What's your opinion of Game Design colleges?
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Joewoof

I'm going to start on my Bachelor's Degree in Computer Science this year, but I'm looking ahead to see where I should go next.

I've heard of FullSail, QANTM, AIE and DigiPen. Of them, QANTM and FullSail seems more promising, while I've heard that DigiPen doesn't teach you anything worthwhile.

Posted on 2005-05-06 04:13:09

Parslip

I've visited the DigiPen campus (was up applying with Microsoft, figured I'd stop by Nintendo HQ while I was in the area), and picked up a course catalog. Seemed fairly intense to me, but was mostly geared towards programming and graphic design. If you want to learn either of those two things specifically oriented towards video games, then it wouldn't be a bad place (though last time I checked, which was a few years ago, they were only accepting .1% of applicants).

I don't know much about the others, I've obviously heard of them but have not yet researched anything about them. I'm guessing it is really going to depend on what you want to focus on - I'm getting my BA in CompSci and then my MBA, because I want to focus on project management within the gaming industry. You may or may not need to attend any of these places, depending on what you want to do.

Posted on 2005-05-06 05:03:21

Joewoof

Then I guess rumors were just that then - rumors. But what caused DigiPen to have such a bad reputation? It is... new, or something? But isn't that the same with most game design colleges?

Posted on 2005-05-06 11:14:17

Parslip

It doesn't have a bad reputation where I'm from (washington state), at least not that I've heard. It isn't new, it was the first of those colleges (I think), about 7-9 years old (can't remember exactly). I remember stories of first-year students there (less then a year out of high school) who had recieved job offers if they left digipen. Others were offered deals that the company would pay for the rest of their education if they aggreed to work for the company afterwards.

Posted on 2005-05-06 14:02:00

Joewoof

I guess it's just some Internet thing then.

Posted on 2005-05-06 14:07:04

Gayo

It seems like a waste of money to me.

Posted on 2005-05-06 16:29:22

Kildorf

Gayo's reply is very short, but I think he may have a point. Are you really sure that now, just getting into a Comp Sci degree, is a good time to be trying to decide what you'll be doing at the end? You might discover you don't even like the stuff that you'll end up doing.

I'm almost done my CS degree; I've got about seven (out of forty) courses worth of credit left to get. At my University, at least, the dropout rate from Computer Science is very high. The number of students in my year has dropped from something close to 300 at first to probably less than 100 or so. They weren't all morons, it's just that some people really do discover that CS isn't what they like. In a similar-but-different scenario, you could discover that you really really enjoy some other aspect of Computer Science and want to go into that instead.

Or you could decide, like me, that you're sick as hell of school, realize you need to get a job so you don't starve to death in the street, and be willing to spend what free time you have figuring things out yourself.

Either way, you're probably not even looking to make decisions now, but rather just doing a bit of research. That's a good thing, just don't decide so heavily on something that you don't consider alternatives, because alternatives are good.

I'll also briefly plug making full use of the breadth-component of a University education. Taking courses in philosophy, religion, mythology, economics, and so on are all good ways to generate ideas about what to make games about, rather than just how to make them. And that, unfortunately, is something you'd miss out on in a Game Design college atmosphere.

Posted on 2005-05-06 16:52:50 (last edited on 2005-05-06 16:53:14)

Joewoof

Wow, those are some excellent points you made there, Kil.

First of all, yes, I know what I'm getting myself into. Unfortunately, few people realize the amount of work that goes into being a Game Designer and pursues that career just for the sake of being exposed to a gaming environment in the workplace. I've done a lot of thinking, and came to a conclusion that this is what I want to do with my life. Long story short, I always have a drive to make something using my imagination since I was in 1st Grade. In Grade 8, I discovered the world of theatre drama, and it became a passion. I realized that what drew me to drama is that I loved how people could enjoy what I do so much on the stage. It, however, doesn't satisfy my desire to create. After a few years, I connected the two-and-two together and came up with my mission statement. 'My dream is to give fun to everyone through masterpieces of creativity'. This is my purpose in life. I'm here to provide entertainment for those living in a harsh stressful world. As a kid, I've looked to video and computer games as and escape from the painful realities of life. I want to give back something to those who made life more interesting and enjoyable - I want to give fun to teenagers like me. The best medium for that is game development. However, there are several positions I can take, why become a game designer? I've read a magazine and it had an interview with a professional game designer. The summary stated that you should be a good writer, speaker, have some artistic talent and great imagination to be able to become a good Game Designer. I also have decent leadership skills, which the designer sometimes needs. After some more research, my conclusion is that this is what I am to be in the future. The Game Designer totally encompasses what I am; therefore, it is in my best interest to pursue that career.

However, as you've clearly pointed out, Kil, people may change. I may find out that there is a better alternative. I mean, who knows? That is exactly why I'm giving it four years while getting a degree in Computer Design. Will I change my mind? Only time will tell.

I do know that Psychology will come in handy. If you know more about people and what they like, you can come up with more effective games. Mythology and religion will surely help with ideas, but economics? I'm not so certain about that one.

Posted on 2005-05-07 04:12:14

Gayo

Oh god. If you want to make games because you love them and want to give an artistic gift to the world, do not under any circumstances become a game designer. That is the path of woe. Also, keep in mind that essentially none of the best game designers ever went to any sort of school for it.

Posted on 2005-05-07 05:18:59

Kildorf

That sounds like a good reason to become a game developer. In fact, it sounds eerily similar to the reason that I have myself. I am a bit worried about your fixation on being a Designer, though.

If you decide to become an independent developer, as many people around these parts (meaning the Verge boards) seem to aspire to, you won't really be able afford to specialize. A team lead, in my view anyway, basically has the job of picking up the slack anywhere that no one else can pick it up. You'll need all the skills you learned in your earlier degree, not to mention ones you probably never thought of. And you'll also probably need a healthy dose of optimism.

If you want to try to break into the established industry... I really don't know how much a game design school will really help. I really don't. I am not an industry guru... but I do know that from what I've seen, game companies are allergic to hiring anyone unproven, except maybe as QA Testers. I have seen tester jobs where they want years of experience, even. Getting a job will probably be based a lot more on what you've got in a portfolio than what education you have, even if it's in a special college.

But then, I could be wrong. I'm not really trying to change your mind about game design college, I just hate seeing intelligent people ending up caught with awkward surprises. I'm averse to specialization, really, so take what I say with a grain of salt.



And yeah, economics can be applied to games like MMORPGs, SimCity, and so on. It's actually also a pretty useful subject to take a few intro classes on for its concepts on things like government and personal spending, the way money is used, and what a lot of words that people say but don't know what they mean actually do mean. At least, it was here, from the prof I took it from. Your mileage may vary.

Posted on 2005-05-07 08:07:31

Joewoof

Dammit, Kil, you're as cool as your avatar implies. Those are some invaluable tips there.

I understand that specialization is risky, but what alternatives are there? The educational system essentially forces you to focus on one field or another. How effective is self-training? I really have no clue.

At least I have a solid foundation. I can multi-task, doing anything from storywriting, character development, gameplay design, graphics, sound editing, and so on. I'm fully confident that I can compose background music, but I'm in the process of learning notes and stuff, so I still have a ways to go for songwriting. Another thing I'm having minor problems with is level design. Since I'm shoddy at that at the moment, I'll need some more practice. My script writing skills (speech dialogue) isn't good enough either, so that's three things I'll have to work on. Otherwise, I'm sure I can fill in any role when the need arises.

Taking your advice, I'll make sure to have my bases cover and learn to do everything possible for a game developer then. Just in case I don't make it as a designer. It's plan C though. Plan A is to be a designer, while B is to be a programmer (the Computer Science degree will surely help). I'm getting there, just need more time and experience.

Ideally, of course, you'd want to just plug your computer to your brain and watch everything come together in warp speed. But where's the challenge in that? :)

Posted on 2005-05-07 09:54:36

Joewoof

Gayo, explanations will help. :)

Posted on 2005-05-07 09:55:46

Joewoof

Getting a job will probably be based a lot more on what you've got in a portfolio than what education you have, even if it's in a special college.
Some magazines are stressing that too. The portfolio seems to be much more important.

How do you go about making one, exactly? Will it include projects you've created using GameMaker or Verge?

Posted on 2005-05-07 10:00:54

Kildorf

A portfolio is basically a sample of the work you've done. I would say that the sort of things you're applying for would give you a good idea about what sort of things to put in there. Anything to convince your prospective employer that you're good enough at what you want to do that you should do it for them.

Since I am currently just a lowly CompSci student with dreams of bigger things who has done a bit of research, I'll use someone else's words rather than mine:

A summary of a roundtable discussion of computer game developers from '97

I think that gives a pretty good (short) overview of what sort of things to have in a portfolio (plus other things about getting into the game industry). You may have to sign up for Gamasutra, but it's free and well worth the time. It has some very good articles.

As for including games made with GameMaker or Verge, I think it depends. If you're applying for a programmer's job, I'd say that it probably wouldn't be that much help. As a designer, artist, writer, etc., I'm guessing that it would be; it still displays what you're trying to sell in yourself.

Is there anyone with actual industry experience that could add to this? All I'm going on here is what research I've done and some (possibly wrong-headed or idealistic) hypothesis.


And thanks for the compliment on my avatar. Ah drew it meself, yuh'see. :)

Posted on 2005-05-07 10:58:35

Joewoof

Yeah, it's oozing with luminosity.

Posted on 2005-05-07 11:07:25

anonymous

might wanna take a look at that:

http://www.blizzard.com/jobopp/bn-lead-game-designer.shtml
http://www.blizzard.com/jobopp/game-designer.shtml

for the actual game designer job. For anything else game-related you can look at that page:

http://www.blizzard.com/jobopp/

I think it pretty much sums up what a good game company is looking for. And I think they describe under certain sections what they want in portfolios...

Posted on 2005-05-07 11:41:33

Joewoof

*slaps forehead repeatedly until blood starts to trickle*

I can't believe that I totally forgot about it! I was reminding myself to check that out the other day before...

...doing an exam... getting the flu... doing an exam while sneezing into the answer sheet... coming back home with a high fever... and waking up the next day thinking about the exam that was already done because it was forgotten that it was done...

...yeah. -_-'

Thanks. I'll go take a look. ^^'

Posted on 2005-05-07 11:44:51

Joewoof

Everything is as I've expected. The resources sure are accurate.

One interesting new fact is how much a highly respectable company values prior experience. I knew that it is important, but not first-priority. I guess it's true then that the ladder is very tall.

Posted on 2005-05-07 11:53:09

Gayo

Everybody everywhere considers prior experience a top priority. If you have a good track record in field X, your chances of getting a job in that field increase stratospherically, regardless of what field it is.

Posted on 2005-05-08 17:03:47

Joewoof

Statospherically, huh? Thanks for the tip. :)

Posted on 2005-05-08 22:19:59


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